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Post by Nezumi on Nov 14, 2009 20:11:45 GMT -5
Well, it has to be done!
My excuse is that it's still my first year in the SCA... I still haven't found a name that fits.
I've also got a thread running on the JML Yahoo group, so a thank you to all nobles who've posted there. I'm hoping to pick the brains of those who don't visit there. ;D
Now, my mundane nickname is Tori, and the local SCA knows me as that. At the advice of my mentor at fighter practice, I'd like to know if I can use Tori as a registerable Japanese female given name. Around 1500's Japan is what I'm aiming for.
John Hidalgo pointed out that O-tori sounds a bit like 'Big Bird' (ō-tori), so even if the pronounciation isn't the same, that one's probably best for me to avoid!
Ii-dono told me that 'Tori' alone is unlikely as a given name, but could be used in a family name. I've found Torii, the same as the shrine gate, on Sengoku Daimyo, and that sounds like a good idea since the pronounciation is similar.
Back to given names again, I like eight (hachi, hatsu, etc..) as a name element, it seems to be a lucky number for me. I've seen it in modern names, but would it have been used in period female given names, and in what form?
Thank you for reading another boring name post!
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Saionji Shonagon
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One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
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Post by Saionji Shonagon on Nov 15, 2009 2:16:08 GMT -5
Now, my mundane nickname is Tori, and the local SCA knows me as that. At the advice of my mentor at fighter practice, I'd like to know if I can use Tori as a registerable Japanese female given name. Just because your modern name is Tori doesn't mean your SCA name has to be. I'm going to defer to those more expert, however, Name Construction In Mediaeval Japan lists both Torime and Torikime as women's names from the Nara period. There is also Tora (Tiger) - and I know at least one lady already using that. The only names listed in Name Construction In Mediaeval Japan with "hachi" ("eight")in it is "Hachiro," which is a man's name and is listed as modern. "Number" names indicating birth order are usually used by men, e.g., Ichiro (first son). |
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Post by Nezumi on Nov 19, 2009 13:12:50 GMT -5
I know it's not necessary, but I want to stick with 'Tori' to make it easier on my friends, who were definately worried that they'd have to call me 'Lady Unpronounceable' forever more.
I haven't been able to get hold of Name Construction In Mediaeval Japan, thanks to my poor student life! I'm jealous if you have a copy!
Once I make a definite decision about the time I wish to exist in, it might not be 1500's after all if my brother wants to go earlier period - and I've got no complaint, since I'll get to wear those layered early period robes - it would be really helpful if you could do a little name-looking-up for me, if you've got the time!
Thank you!
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Post by Yamamoto Morikazu on Nov 19, 2009 13:30:16 GMT -5
i like Torikime.
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Saionji Shonagon
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One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
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Post by Saionji Shonagon on Nov 19, 2009 19:21:20 GMT -5
Once I make a definite decision about the time I wish to exist in, it might not be 1500's after all if my brother wants to go earlier period - and I've got no complaint, since I'll get to wear those layered early period robes - it would be really helpful if you could do a little name-looking-up for me, if you've got the time! A couple of things: 1. You do NOT have to tie your time period to anyone else's just because you're related in real life or friends - unless you want to. 2. You don't wear those "layered early period robes" so much as they wear you. My full formal Heian karaginu mo clocks in at about 30 pounds and consists of approximately 70 yards of fabric. You've got to make it, you've got to iron it, you've got to drag it across floors it was never meant to traverse (carpet will exhaust you very quickly), you've got to spot clean it after you've worn it, fold it ALL up and put it away. I'm not saying it's not worth doing, I just think you need to have an idea of what you're getting into. My personal record for wearing formal Heian dress (complete with make-up) is about six hours.... 3. See if your local herald has a copy of NCMJ or knows someone who has, if you'd like to thumb through it. Or keep asking here. Solveig-hime, the author, is on this forum and JML often enough to toss in her two sen on name questions. I decided to get a copy recently and if you are interested in names and language, it's definitely a nice addition to one's library. However, if you're not interested beyond choosing a name for yourself, you don't really need to own it. |
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Post by Nezumi on Nov 19, 2009 20:05:20 GMT -5
1. Since it looks like I'll be stuck with him and end up sharing kit and a pavillion, it would make more sense - but yes, I'm not making any decisions based on other people. If I was, I'd be re-enacting European!  2. I'm a cosplayer, and a heavy fighter, enough said. I can handle big gear. ;D 3. I think I'll go without as I only need one name, I've had a lot of luck sieving through Wikipedia - I've actually been thinking about making a period names list based on my findings if I can verify them elsewhere. |
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Post by Nezumi on Nov 25, 2009 20:54:04 GMT -5
So, after extensive research (ok, sort of casual kanji spotting), these are the ones I've came across. I'm quite certain that some of these were used in female given names, but not so sure about others... would anyone happen to have a large name dictionary of any kind?  Spotted in online history resources, etc: 菊 Kiku - crysanthemum 桃 Momo - peach 楽 Raku - ease, comfort, fun 鈴 Suzu - bell 糸 Ito - thread Used today, might have been historic too: 梅 Ume - plum/apricot 禄 Roku, Yoshi - blessings, prosperity 初 Hatsu - first 郁 Iku - perfume 寿 Toshi, Sumi, Nobu, Nori, Hisa, and several more - congratulations, long life. This is a weird one since it's got so many name readings. Now I need to decide which fits with Torii no... |
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Saionji Shonagon
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One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
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Post by Saionji Shonagon on Nov 25, 2009 22:28:23 GMT -5
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Post by Nezumi on Nov 26, 2009 10:13:44 GMT -5
Ooh yes, happy Thanksgiving!  Mmm pie! SCA people are always good cooks, I need to practice - my pie would probably count as medieval chemical warfare.  |
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Saionji Shonagon
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One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
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Post by Saionji Shonagon on Nov 26, 2009 13:26:07 GMT -5
From Solveig-hime's book, Name Construction in Mediaeval Japan. Oh, and how far I get is subject to how long it takes me to look all this up while the last pie is baking:
菊 Kiku - chrysanthemum
Page 164: Kiku, Kikumatsu and Kikume listed as women's names.
桃 Momo - peach
Page 160: Momoko
Page 215, different kanji meaning "One hundred", Momoe, Momoko, Momome, Momote and Momoteme.
楽 Raku - ease, comfort, fun
Can't find it.
鈴 Suzu - bell
Page 272, Suzu.
糸 Ito - thread
Page 275, Ito, Ito'ito.
Used today, might have been historic too:
梅 Ume - plum/apricot
Page 161, Mume, Umeme
禄 Roku, Yoshi - blessings, prosperity
P. 313, Roku is listed as an era name only.
P. 129 different kanji meaning Fresh, Bright, Splendid: Yoshiko.
初 Hatsu - first
Nope.
郁 Iku - perfume
Nope.
寿 Toshi, Sumi, Nobu, Nori, Hisa, and several more - congratulations, long life. This is a weird one since it's got so many name readings.
No on Sumi with that reading.
P. 120, Hisako
P. 231, Different kanji meaning excellence: Hisako.
And I'm stopping there because there are too doggone many index listings for Toshi, Nobu and Nori.
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Post by Nezumi on Nov 26, 2009 21:14:23 GMT -5
Thank you so much, the greatest of thanks!
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