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Post by Noriko on Sept 10, 2007 19:58:15 GMT -5
I could have sworn I already asked this question on the forums but... Does anyone have any resources on what early Japanese people would have eaten off of? I have some great pictures of clay dinnerware but considering that last event I went to resulted in the destruction of my bowl, I bought one of those bamboo bowls that have been popping up everywhere (though for a fraction of the price)[1]. How "period" is the use of wood in tableware (for a merchant persona anyway)[2]? I mean, we can't know for sure since most of it would not have survived but... [1]This: though the lines of wood go the other way (vertical)  [2]Huge outdoor event != wearing hakama and near floor length robes. (: Also, none of the plastic "laquerware" at the Asian market appeals to me... |
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Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
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Post by Saionji Shonagon on Sept 10, 2007 23:12:54 GMT -5
Hate those bamboo bowls. Hate em. They are eVIL like the frewitt of the deVIL. Don't let them soak in water, ever.
The thing about plastic lacquerware is that it's not going to be a tragedy if it rolls out of your basket and off the tailgate and onto the asphalt (had that happen to a favorite beaker once). They are an inexpensive fake of lacquered wood.
As for what shows up in museum collections, it tends to be a dizzying array of ceramics. From terracotta haniwa figures to Mino, Shino, and Oribe.....
(In other words, I don't honestly KNOW about wooden tableware.)
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Post by Please Delete on Sept 11, 2007 6:18:34 GMT -5
Plain wood and lacquered bowls seems to be common. For SCA feasts, make sure you have a knife, as most western cooks will not cook things to be eaten with chopsticks. A spoon was traditional until the early to mid-Heian period for upper class folks (I need to get a few made for times when you really just need a spoon). We are also looking into pottery. There is evidence of various forms of fired pottery used, and porcelain was imported from the mainland (though I'm not sure that it was really created in Japan until very late or post period--I seem to recall Seto, in the area of Owari, was one of the first places to start producing it in Japan on a large scale). If I remember, tonight I'll go through our pictures on flickr and see what I can find, but for the moment I'll just point you here: flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/sets/72157600770705582/This was a meal we had at Rokusei in Kyoto for our anniversary. They had researched and replicated a Heian imperial banquet. There were two anachronisms: The tempura was used because it was something people (read: people paying lots of money for the food) would be familiar and comfortable with, and the tea that is a Japanese staple today, rather like serving water in a modern restaurant, almost. Anyway, take a look at those dishes--high-end, but it gives you an idea of Heian dishes and utensils. -Ii |
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Post by Please Delete on Sept 11, 2007 19:09:25 GMT -5
Hmmm... looked back at those pictures, and I'd have to say the bottle probably isn't period  However, here's a few things to look at: So, I'll start here: www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/275264847/in/set-72157600770705582/This shows a very common layout and the dishes are what I often see in either paintings or recreations. For the most part they are lacquered wood or silver. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/275264952/in/set-72157600770705582/Another view of the dishes. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/275264987/in/set-72157600770705582/Here are some silver dishes for the dipping sauces. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/275265035/in/set-72157600770705582/Here's a look at the spoon. It is resting on the lacquered lid of one of the soup bowls. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/275265263/in/set-72157600770705582/Although the tempura is late to post-period, the stand is a very common design. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/275265525/in/set-72157600770705582/I don't know about this plate--it strikes me as a much later influence, but didn't seem out of place. At the Tokyo Museum, there are several different things. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/284662630/in/set-72157600772093455/This one and similar ones are mostly influenced by the later tea cults, as I recall (I tried to capture photos of the informational plates as well, though some didn't come out too well) www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/284682979/in/set-72157600772093455/Here are examples of items found in Japan (some from China) www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/284659694/in/set-72157600772093455/Here's some old kitchen equipment (I believe this may be Chinese, but there are similar things found in Japan) www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=284661451&context=set-72157600772093455&size=oSome details from our favorite painting, the Maple Viewers. I recommend looking it up for more info. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/280601956/in/set-72157600771983623/Here's a good example of later period meals. www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/280602085/in/set-72157600771983623/Along with the above (both from Nagoya Castle) this is a good example of later period meals (actually, these are probably post-period, but I do not believe that it is too far from what they would have been using in late pre-Edo). www.flickr.com/photos/tatsushu/277250460/in/set-72157600771197254/This is a good look at different types of pots, considering that some of the shapes continued until after the Edo period. I have some photos of dishes from museums in England, but I'll have to wait till I get those uploaded. Let me know if this kind of stuff helps. -Ii |
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Post by solveig on Sept 11, 2007 20:10:48 GMT -5
Noble Cousin! Greetings from Solveig! Does anyone have any resources on what early Japanese people would have eaten off of? Please define early. Incidentally, I know of a big fat book on the history of Japanese tableware. Actually, the book I was thinking of also deals with kitchen equipment ISBN: 4639014538 I do not recommend bamboo bowls. Bamboo was used extensively for a lot of stuff, but ceramic and wooden bowls are much more common than bamboo bowls. As for spoons. Iconographic evidence suggests that spoons had very long narrow handles and were not at all like those spoons you encounter at modern Chinese-American restaurants. |
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madyaas
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Point Lobos
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Post by madyaas on Sept 11, 2007 20:37:46 GMT -5
I am amazed by that big cylinder of rice!
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Post by Noriko on Sept 11, 2007 21:03:05 GMT -5
Noble Cousin! Please define early. Incidentally, I know of a big fat book on the history of Japanese tableware. Heian era, I should have been more specific. The only reason I thought bamboo was a good idea was that it would be easier to take to events. I was quite saddened when I lost my favorite feast gear bowl to an accidental drop. I suppose it is a "wooden" bowl in some respects- no one would know it was bamboo unless I told them. So if wood is period for bowls from the Heian era for middle/lower classes then it suits the purpose I need. OTOH, I have more chopsticks than I know what to do with, though only one set "passes" as period. |
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Post by Please Delete on Sept 11, 2007 22:09:33 GMT -5
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Post by Please Delete on Sept 11, 2007 22:12:33 GMT -5
I am amazed by that big cylinder of rice! That seems to be the tradition for rice early on. There is a great scene in 'Yamai no Soshi' that shows a huge mound of rice in someone's bowl (not as neat as this--this was not actually a cylinder; the top was wider than the bottom! I have ideas as to how that could be done, but it was impressive, nonetheless). -Ii |
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However, here's a few things to look at:
