Ki?

[Otagiri Tatsuzou]

Do you see ki as an essential component of martial arts?
Is it a 'emergent property' that comes with other martial training?
Or is it just so much b.s.?

I had pretty much ignored ki in the SCA context until my rereading of Yamaoka Tesshu and the Tengu-geijutsu-ron. Now I am reexamining my initial dismissal and trying to deepen my historical understanding of how warriors in the sixteenth century might have perceived it. For instance, has it always been a component of ryu training?

A related question: Should ki be trained for specifically? If so, how?

[Hiroyuki]

it was/is an integral part of most(if not all... ) forms of karate. . .

atleast in the okinawan styles I have seen/read about...

probably not much help... y background is in BJJ, and KI is not mentioned there...

[Please Delete]

From an historical perspective, understanding the concept of 'ki' is, imho, crucial to understanding Japanese training and concepts. It's rather like understanding the four humours to understand Mediaeval European medicinal thought.

On the other hand, I have found that the concept of 'ki' helps people conceptualize a lot that is hard to define. Unfortunately, it carries a lot of spiritual 'baggage' with it for many people.

For me, 'ki' is a visualization that helps bring other things together.

For instance, telling people to imagine there is an invisible line between their kissaki and their opponent's throat (or eye, or whatever). Telling people to connect their tsuka with their center. These things are all visualizations.

Also, attitude and ki: tell people to extend ki forward to get them to reach a little extra bit without tensing up too much. Imagining key flowing through the arms to help the 'unbendable arm'. Using a vocalized 'kiai' to help bring mind/body/sword together.

Mechanically, these could all be accomplished by a very good robot. However, the concept of 'ki' helps people to visualize what they need to do, which seems to take care of a lot of little details that really can't be 'thought' about while executing the technique.

I'm rambling, but hopefully this makes sense to someone out there.

[Rokurou]

From what I understand about Ki, from my limited knowledge of Budo Taijutsu, it is an integral part of any, if not all martial arts. From Judo to Karate to Kick Boxing to Aikido to, yes, even Ninjutsu. Unfortunatly Ki is used differently in the afor mentioned examples. Take for instance Aikido. When you are being attacked, you are suppose to "blend" with the attackers Ki and redirect his Ki to your benifit without doing any harm to the attacker. Now on the otherhand, in Ninjutsu, Ki is used to the utmost benifit of the defender in that the defender is able to detect an attacker, even in total darkness. Now before I hear anyone say bulls@%*, let me explain that I've actually seen it work this way and even experianced it myself. Believe me when I say it feels weird, and everyone has the ability to develop their own level of Ki "detection". Beginners are more often than not able to "experiance" the feeling involved more so than someone "trying to feel Ki. The last few times I was tested i didn't feel much of anything because I was trying too hard to feel something. I just need to train more and learn to relax more. Also in Ninjutsu, it is used to give that extra little oompf to a punch. I haven't experianced that yet and hope I never will. I'm told it really hurts, a lot. I believe that is what is used in Katate to break boards and bricks. In the other mentioned styles of Martial arts, i haven't found many example of Ki being used, but I'm sure historically it was used. Knowing what you opponent is going to do before they do it is a definate tactical advantage. I personally recommend study in Ki sensing, but then again I'm partial to it. Hope this helps.

[Takeda Hirotsune]

I agree fully with Katsumori. Ki is a concept that allows you to focus your mind and body on the motion you want to perform. By visualising you ki energy, you are actually visualising what you're going to do.

And do not get carried away by all magic-poof that surrounds it. In karate, it is not the Ki that allows a guy to break a board of wood, it's the lining up of the bones in his had that all energy can be transferred into forward movement instead of lateral movement.

I can knock a guy of his feet by just placing my fist against his chest. It is no some mystical energy that manifests and knocks him. It is the visualisation of that energy that makes your arm line up properly and the hip and torso fully support the minute movement you make with your fist.

And as for ki sensing, I don't believe it's Ki, but I do believe people can sense attention directed to them. And most of it is intuition. Your body picks up a lot of signals, yet most of them do not enter the consious part of your brain. If you listen to intuition (gut insitinct), you can 'know' a lot of things. For example, when running around rooms and corridors, I almost always know where to find people without ever seeing them. I somehow know where they are and where they are not. During paintball and laser matches, this usually allows me to run recklessly along openings and doors and corridors other would be cautios to cross, simply because I know there's nobody there anyway (those who play against me really hate it ).

But this is not something mystical. As I run, my ears have long since picked up sounds and my skin has already picked up movement and aircurrents. Without even thinking about it, my body is already telling me 'there's nobody beside you but theres someone about 2 rooms away'. Couple this with a good dose of extrapolation (I spot a guy running through a corridor and lose sight of him. But by extrapolating his movements and possibilities, I can usually predict where I can find him) and you have all the ingredients for 'magic-poof'.

[deathbird]

Yes Takeda, there is a fine line between Haragei and Ki. Haragei can be used as a sort of radar... Ki/Chi can be used to enhance a strike, enhance shiatsu (after you struck your uke), and also be used for bubishi techniques i.e. meridian disruption. Its not magic, just as inherent as being able to use your perepheral vision (purple rods) to see in low light, and even to see the "bio-field" around people. I have taught this as part of my enhanced Bujinkan curriculum to my students for nearly a decade. Some take longer than others to get it, but they all get it in time.

[Otagiri Tatsuzou]

admin said:

... and trying to deepen my historical understanding of how warriors in the sixteenth century might have perceived it.

Sun Pin is a Chinese military philosopher of the fourth century BC and possibly a descendent of Sun Tzu. His Military Methods was a lost classic and would not have directly influenced Japanese military studies but still provides an interesting look into historical military theory.

There is a chapter, mostly in fragments, on Expanding Chi. In this context, it might be best translated as morale and maybe fortitude - qualities of 'eagerness for battle,' 'focus', and 'stick-to-it-ness'. Privation, such as light coats in winter or avoiding indulgence in food, seem to be tools to 'expand chi.'

"When you form the army and assemble the masses, concentrate upon stimulating their chi. When you again decamp and reassemble the army, concentrate upon ordering the soldiers and sharpening their chi. When you approach the border and draw near the enemy, concentrate upon honing their chi. When the day for battle has been set, concentrate upon making their chi decisive. When the day for battle is at hand, concentrate upon expanding their chi ..."

"... The short coat and coarse clothes, which encourage a warrior's determination, are the means by which to hone their chi. The commanding general issues orders to have every single man prepare (only) three day's rations ..."

"... when their chi is not honed, they will be frightened. When they are frightened, then they will mass together. ... When their chi is not decisive, then they will be slack. When they are slack, they will not be focused and will easily disperse ..."