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Post by Tatsuya on Oct 30, 2007 15:26:38 GMT -5
sugar in tea? soda with sushi? drenching food in shoyu?
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Saionji Shonagon
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Post by Saionji Shonagon on Oct 30, 2007 15:55:16 GMT -5
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madyaas
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Post by madyaas on Oct 30, 2007 19:26:17 GMT -5
Fermented Soybeans. Some would say "rotten soybeans". Seriously, the least food-like substance commonly consumed by the Japanese, and a popular breakfast staple. Our Korean/Japanese market sells natto, but the container is so big, I'm stuck on the fence about buying it. I'm totally curious. Perhaps I'll blow the several bucks and bite the bullet? Something I always find amusing is how a lot of people think the entirety of the Japanese population are 100% refined and proper with their food 24/7, despite lots of native convenience food, and things like curry rice, squid ink pizza, and poor excuses for salsa (a friend of mine was an exchange student there. She said the fast food there was traumatic). People are people, and people will eat crap if they find it tasty (and/or cheap).
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Post by Water_Tengu on Oct 30, 2007 21:44:04 GMT -5
Seriously, the least food-like substance commonly consumed by the Japanese, and a popular breakfast staple. Our Korean/Japanese market sells natto, but the container is so big, I'm stuck on the fence about buying it. I'm totally curious. Perhaps I'll blow the several bucks and bite the bullet? Something I always find amusing is how a lot of people think the entirety of the Japanese population are 100% refined and proper with their food 24/7, despite lots of native convenience food, and things like curry rice, squid ink pizza, and poor excuses for salsa (a friend of mine was an exchange student there. She said the fast food there was traumatic). People are people, and people will eat crap if they find it tasty (and/or cheap). very, VERY true
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bovil
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Post by bovil on Oct 30, 2007 21:56:54 GMT -5
People are people, and people will eat crap if they find it tasty (and/or cheap). Natto isn't Japanese junk food, it's a cultural heritage food, kind of like lutefisk is for Norwegians or hkarl is for Icelanders. Biggest difference is that many Japanese still eat natto daily, where Icelanders pretty much only eat hkarl (or "putrid shark," as it's often translated) for the annual Icelandic food heritage festival, and Norwegians are smart enough to get Norwegian-Americans to eat most of their lutefisk...
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Post by roninpenguin on Oct 30, 2007 22:26:15 GMT -5
I do admit that I like to sweeten my teas (weather black, green, or spiced) with at least a touch of sugar. I can drink (and especially with green tea) enjoy unsweetened tea, but I prefer it with a little honey or sugar. I know, I'm disowned...
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Post by Imagawa Tadamori on Oct 30, 2007 23:28:55 GMT -5
they'll put sugar in their green tea or order soda, and they'll just dump soy sauce and stuff all over their food as soon as they get it without tasting it first. Sugar in green tea is just wrong. However, you'll take my diet coke away from me when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. I shamelessly order diet soda at Japanese restaurants. If we're going to complain about that, we should also complain about the delicious cocktails that Barracuda in San Francisco offer with their Japanese food . If that's your beverage of choice, so be it. I don't have an issue with soda. I like Diet Coke too. I'm just one of those "when in Rome..." kind of people. My opinion is that tea is appropriate in a Japanese restaurant. Soda is not. Maybe its the food purist in me. Maybe its the part of me that believes "I'm in a Japanese restaurant, in a Japanese atmosphere, eating Japanese food, drinking Japanese drinks... so I should do so in a Japanese manner in order to fully appreciate the experience." I don't know. I get weird like that sometimes. Of course, I usually border on having a meltdown because they don't appreciate subtlety and delicate flavors/textures, and the words "uncultured heathens" (or something similar) can normally be heard coming from my end of the table repeatedly during dinner. I have managed to educate some of them, and we're working on the others. I know you're not dead serious here, but such a thing is something that I think is much more improper than sweetened green tea, sushi soaked in soy sauce or soda ordered with dinner. Your manners at the table with others are as important as your manners with your food. I may have embellished a bit, but the thoughts are there. I usually keep my mouth shut about most of it, but I have used the "uncultured heathens" comment before on a few occaisions. I normally get a "thank you" in return, at which point I'll usually just give in and go with it. Pick your battles, as they say. We're pretty good about our manners, but not perfect. Something I always find amusing is how a lot of people think the entirety of the Japanese population are 100% refined and proper with their food 24/7, despite lots of native convenience food Then you must think I'm frickin' hilarious... ;D People are people, and people will eat crap if they find it tasty (and/or cheap). See? See? You HAVE met some of my friends... I do admit that I like to sweeten my teas (weather black, green, or spiced) with at least a touch of sugar. I can drink (and especially with green tea) enjoy unsweetened tea, but I prefer it with a little honey or sugar. I know, I'm disowned... Let the floggings begin... LOL. Kidding... ;D - Rich
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bovil
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Post by bovil on Oct 31, 2007 1:11:57 GMT -5
I do admit that I like to sweeten my teas (weather black, green, or spiced) with at least a touch of sugar. I can drink (and especially with green tea) enjoy unsweetened tea, but I prefer it with a little honey or sugar. I take lapsang souchong with a bit of honey or raw sugar... ...but I haven't got good enough Horde connections to get yak butter.
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Post by Water_Tengu on Oct 31, 2007 11:06:21 GMT -5
I do admit that I like to sweeten my teas (weather black, green, or spiced) with at least a touch of sugar. I can drink (and especially with green tea) enjoy unsweetened tea, but I prefer it with a little honey or sugar. I know, I'm disowned... now see i was raised in southern Georgia,, it's difficult for me to drink any kind of tea without sugar, unless there is a gyro to be had
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madyaas
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Post by madyaas on Oct 31, 2007 16:52:58 GMT -5
People are people, and people will eat crap if they find it tasty (and/or cheap). Natto isn't Japanese junk food, it's a cultural heritage food, kind of like lutefisk is for Norwegians or hkarl is for Icelanders. Please point out where I said that. I never said natto was junk food, which is why I separated my comments about natto into a separate comment from the one about the Japanese eating junk food. I'd appreciate not being accused of saying things I am not saying. Thanks, dude.
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madyaas
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Post by madyaas on Oct 31, 2007 16:59:24 GMT -5
If that's your beverage of choice, so be it. I don't have an issue with soda. I like Diet Coke too. I'm just one of those "when in Rome..." kind of people. My opinion is that tea is appropriate in a Japanese restaurant. Soda is not. Maybe its the food purist in me. Maybe its the part of me that believes "I'm in a Japanese restaurant, in a Japanese atmosphere, eating Japanese food, drinking Japanese drinks... so I should do so in a Japanese manner in order to fully appreciate the experience." I don't know. I get weird like that sometimes. See, I disagree here. If this were a traditional Japanese restaurant that I patronize which is served in a traditional way, with traditional furnishings, seating, etc. etc, then yes, I would agree that to ask for a Soda would be inappropriate. Considering that I frequent Japanese restaurants that are hardly traditional (using mayonnaise on some sushi or sriracha to dip and garnish the plate), then I find it a bit... picky to even raise an eyebrow about soda being served with the food. I mean, the two Japanese exchange students I met my freshman year (one of whom had a father who was a sushi chef in Tokyo) would have soda with their food at Japanese restaurants here as well. But, you're right, you pick your battles. I admit, I have problems with foodies, especially those who tell me how I should do something and that what I'm doing is wrong or terrible (such as when a friend told me I couldn't drink Port wine in summer... screw that). I'm not saying you're like that, but I have issues with food elitism (don't even get me going about Anthony Bourdain *hiss*).
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Post by Imagawa Tadamori on Nov 1, 2007 1:27:04 GMT -5
If that's your beverage of choice, so be it. I don't have an issue with soda. I like Diet Coke too. I'm just one of those "when in Rome..." kind of people. My opinion is that tea is appropriate in a Japanese restaurant. Soda is not. Maybe its the food purist in me. Maybe its the part of me that believes "I'm in a Japanese restaurant, in a Japanese atmosphere, eating Japanese food, drinking Japanese drinks... so I should do so in a Japanese manner in order to fully appreciate the experience." I don't know. I get weird like that sometimes. See, I disagree here. If this were a traditional Japanese restaurant that I patronize which is served in a traditional way, with traditional furnishings, seating, etc. etc, then yes, I would agree that to ask for a Soda would be inappropriate. Considering that I frequent Japanese restaurants that are hardly traditional (using mayonnaise on some sushi or sriracha to dip and garnish the plate), then I find it a bit... picky to even raise an eyebrow about soda being served with the food. The restaurant in question is always on the "top 5 restaurants in Rockford" lists, looks like a Japanese temple from the outside, and it has both indoor and outdoor koi ponds. $2000+ kimonos, porcelain vases & dolls, art, century old tea sets, etc are in the cases scattered around the lobby and the dining rooms. It has the main dining area, a separate sushi cafe, private dining rooms, Japanese wait staff, 20+ kinds of premium sake (served traditionally), the owner's surname is Kobiyashi, I've been going there for 15+ years, know the owner on a first name basis, and Mas (the owner) has plum wine for my entire party brought over to the table - on the house - whenever he sees me in there. And I've been over to his house before. That is why I have the hangup about the soda (only at Japanese restaurants. My other hangup is people who put chopsticks in an empty rice bowl or lay them flat on the table with nothing under them). I admit, I have problems with foodies, especially those who tell me how I should do something and that what I'm doing is wrong or terrible (such as when a friend told me I couldn't drink Port wine in summer... screw that). I'm not saying you're like that, but I have issues with food elitism (don't even get me going about Anthony Bourdain *hiss*). Ahhhhhhh..... ok. I see where you're coming from now. I'm not a foodie. No no no. Foodies annoy me too. My issue is proper observance of culture (as appropriate) and respect for others when in their environment. Take the soda thing. My issue there was not about being "anti-soda"; it was about "why don't you appreciate your surroundings and the ambience that your host has worked so hard to achieve for you and drink the traditional beverage?" As far as the Port thing, tell your friend that the Touriga Nacional grapes used to make the wine like hot weather and you're giving them what they want. And if the wine joke doesn't work, may I suggest setting him/her out on your deck on a nice summer evening in a cozy chair with a glass of Port and a plate of honeydew melon, Mozzarella cheese, and your favorite stone ground wheat crackers (I'm not a sommelier by any stretch of the imagination; that Port/melon/cheese/crackers combo is how I got introduced to Port and it was really, really tasty). If that doesn't bring them around, then I don't know what will. A food elitist I'm not. I like high-end food sometimes, and I'll try pretty much anything once, but I'm also the guy who eats tortillas and hummus at 3:00 in the morning and likes habanero Tabasco on his scrambled eggs. All I can say about Anthony Bourdain is that if those people didn't get compensated for being on the show, half of them would have taken him out back and whooped him for his disrespect and holier-than-thou attitude. Pretty much sum it up? - Rich
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madyaas
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Post by madyaas on Nov 1, 2007 12:50:03 GMT -5
That is why I have the hangup about the soda (only at Japanese restaurants. My other hangup is people who put chopsticks in an empty rice bowl or lay them flat on the table with nothing under them). See, that restaurant you're speaking of is one where I'd either stick with tea, or if I must have something sweet, plum wine. It's like the difference between an informal bistro and going to the French Laundry (a very expensive 5 star restaurant in Yountville, CA). I wouldn't order soda at the French Laundry, but I would at the bistro. I was taught ages ago by a friend that even with the disposable chopsticks to make a hashioki from the wrapper See, understand where you're coming from, but personally if the chef or owner feels it a slight to their work to have people order soda, then it shouldn't be included on the menu. Only a very few will actively complain and make a scene if it's not on the menu. The funny thing is, my friend is big into wines and leads wine tours of the wineries around here. He makes me nervous about wines actually. But, his comments were peppered with humor and a bit of sarcasm too, so he wasn't all serious. I fired back with "Well, I'm sorry if I'm not drinking wine crushed by footless widows in bordeaux who create wines that smell like provence in spring with hints of chanel no 5". Yeah, I have issues with elitism in any form. I don't like such exclusionary attitudes. I have friends who LOVE Anthony Bourdain. One linked an article of his which essentially said "If you are not a trained chef, your opinion of food means nothing, and you have no business having a cooking show (referring to Rachael Ray, Sandra Lee, Paula Deen)". I saw his show once which immediately turned me off to him. He was going on and on about how you can only find true mole in Mexico. But i've heard other people talk about his show and how he'll actively refuse food offered to him. He tries to look hardcore because he knows the foodies will fall at his feet in adoration. They've actually applauded his asshole attitude (that's the second thing I hate, people who are jerks). I agree with you, I hope someone takes him to the parking lot to teach him a lesson!
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bovil
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Post by bovil on Nov 1, 2007 15:09:16 GMT -5
Please point out where I said that. It was not a stretch to make that connection. If you're going to be anywhere near San Jose the beginning of January, swing up to the Doubletree for Kingdom 12th night and I'll pour you some sake to make up for it.
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madyaas
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Post by madyaas on Nov 1, 2007 15:12:44 GMT -5
Please point out where I said that. It was not a stretch to make that connection. However, I did not say that. Thanks.
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