|
|
Post by Please Delete on May 25, 2008 22:15:37 GMT -5
Yes, leather lacing was in use in armour at the time. Fancy stuff would use printed leather. Alternatively you would use a silk braid (actually, many had a combination, with certain lacing on the edges often being a thin piece of leather while lacing on the majority was silk braid.
I agree about the translating--Heike Monogatari has some wonderful material, but it is hard to sift through and find out what they are talking about. E.g. the corselet--I'm assuming there they are probably talking about a piece of the armour, but I can't tell from the immediate context if they are talking about the waki-ita (side board) used on many o-yoroi, or perhaps a haramaki or similar thing (it was known that people would wear garments over bits of their armour--Kiyomori is lambasted in the literature for wearing armour under his priestly robes, as I recall).
I'll see if I can find any more pictorial evidence for the discussion.
-Ii
|
|
Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
|
Post by Saionji Shonagon on May 25, 2008 22:21:27 GMT -5
Yes, leather lacing was in use in armour at the time. Fancy stuff would use printed leather. Thanks for clarification - I honestly didn't know. Since McCullough specifically says "suit of armor" in that second passage, I'd guess the "corselet" is some individual piece of body armor as opposed to full battle array. |
|
|
|
Post by Please Delete on May 25, 2008 22:24:29 GMT -5
Grrr... sorry folks. There was a great picture of Ippen preaching that had great Kamakura clothing details--and I've got no clue where it has gone to. It was a special exhibit at the Freer-Sackler: Maybe it will turn up eventually.
-Josh
|
|
Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
|
Post by Saionji Shonagon on May 26, 2008 10:55:51 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by Please Delete on May 26, 2008 18:40:04 GMT -5
Actually, not that one, but it is pretty cool. No, there is another one I saw, some time ago, at the Freer-Sackler. -Ii PS: Watch, I'll find it and then realize I was misremembering and it is a Muromachi scroll or something similar  |
|
|
|
Post by Mushime on Jun 13, 2008 8:41:35 GMT -5
Saionji-sama, in your post with the picture of the kamamura jidai ladies, am I seeing a darker layer UNDER the kosode that has become outerwear? If so, does it have it's own name or is it merely another kosode in a darker color?
Thank you for your time and patience.
|
|
Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
|
Post by Saionji Shonagon on Jun 13, 2008 10:11:05 GMT -5
Saionji-sama, in your post with the picture of the kamamura jidai ladies, am I seeing a darker layer UNDER the kosode that has become outerwear? (Inscrutable sensei mode). Are you? Look at it. Think about it. See if you can find other images from the period and compare. Unfortunately, I have not been able to track down a copy of that image to find out whether the original was in color. I suspect the underlayer could be red. I've seen some modern Shinto shrine attendants in their version of this outfit with alternating layers of red and white under a white outer kosode. Regarding names - the Japanese can and do have multiple names for what is essentially a kosode depending on whether it's an inner or outer layer, lined, unlined, and so forth. I find it's just easier to call a kosode a kosode in most cases. |
|
|
|
Post by Mushime on Jun 13, 2008 11:29:23 GMT -5
Inscrutable sensei, thank you. This gnat is humbled.
|
|
