Japanese plates, cups and utensils

[Noriko]

Ohayo gozaimasu!
While my present Japanese-esque feast gear has been suitable until now (mostly chopsticks and a cup)[1], I'm hoping to get a bit more information on exactly what types of plates and bowls would have been used. I have a feeling my rectangle shaped plate isn't exactly period...
Does anyone have any ideas on what the lovely recipies mentioned in this section of the forum would have been served on, specifically, in the Heian era?
Thanks!

[1]My present feast gear bowl: www.timeshouseware.com/product.asp?pid=200
The plate matches and the cup is stripey brown with blue on the inside.

[Saionji Shonagon]

I see that pattern all over Nihonmachi - it's very popular.

Japanese feastware has rarely been an issue as Jehanne is usually the one who attends feasts. Saionji has only once ever eaten at an event and what a horror that was. After picking black bits out of my lunch and having to retouch my ohaguro, and having my eyes burning by midafternoon from the perspiration I could not blot from my whitened face, I ended up washing off all my makeup and tooth black to get through dinner. For that instance, I bundled up a pair of hashi and several mismatched pottery bowls of generally Asian shape and took those along.

Ii-dono and Abe-hime threw a flower viewing party about a year ago - photos can be seen at
modzer0.cs.uaf.edu/~logan/HanamiParty/index.php?var=rep2

Perhaps they can comment on what was on the tables.

S.

[Ishikawa Yoshimasa]

I found a nice set of melomine feastgear through e-kitron in thier resteraunt supply section. the series is titled temoku, and looks like black laquerware.

www.ekitron.com/eshop/ids_cate_fisrt.asp?subcate=SUB07&cate=C05&desc=Restaurant

while I am sure they are post period profiles and styles, they are melomine which will last many more events than ceramics will, yet still do not look too bad... the drawback is I was intent on doing a set of dishes for four before I got my lathe, and the total cost would have been a couple hundred dollars. I am contemplating still getting a few items such as one of thier bento boxes. I do not have the info on this computer, but I believe I found cheaper sources for thier sushi-oke, but they had some nice geta, paticularly that bamboo one that is about 10"

I am presently trying to find info on bowl profiles so that I can make some paterns for turning a set on my lathe. I don't know how common turned wood was given how much I find on ceramics, but it is the medium I work with and not as fragile as ceramics...

good luck...

[solveig]

Noble Cousin!

Greetings from Solveig!

noriko said:

Does anyone have any ideas on what the lovely recipies mentioned in this section of the forum would have been served on, specifically, in the Heian era.

Well, as with all things Japanse, it depends upon what sort of event you are at. However, I will assume that you are interested in recreating a banquet. Here you should consider having a collection of round bowls in a variety of diameters and depths. Although, some drawings of banquet presentations do show most of the bowls being of the same diameter. There are a few important small diameter bowls that you should have. One of these is for vinegar which was an important condiment. There is also good reason to expect a long handled narrow spoon to be provided along with chopsticks. As for colour. White would not be completely improbably. Please do not buy tenmoku bowls. Either they are not really tenmoku or they will be inappropriate. Real tenmoku blowls are of conicle shape and require a stand to keep them from falling over. The only place where I know of their use is in certain types of ritual tea associated with places like Daitokuji.

[Takeda Sanjuichiro]

Word of advice to any who plan on doing Japanese feast gear. If you can, avoid ceramics, they are way too heavy (and fragile) to lug around. The exception to this would be a ceramic tea bowl, one to hold in the heat of hot beverage, and ceramic helps keep a cool beverage cool.

Abe-hime is an awesome shopper... she has been the one to find all the good deals to stock up on many of the nessecities! Our local Nihonjin are blessed with her finding deals at Super H, An Han Reum and a local store The Samurai Store... low priced plastic lacquerware, YEAH!

Maybe we could see about placing a bulk order of sets at a discount if people are interested?

As far as the selection of things to put in your feast kit.
here is the basics for mine (When I'm not cooking/serving)

1 pair of hashi
1 small razor sharp knife to prep food, which I try to hide.
(Nanban chefs are so insistant on serving hunks of food
too big to eat politely with hashi)
2-3 small bowls
1 bowl for beverage
2 "plates" generally these are used as trays
1 very small condiment bowl for vinegar or soysauce
1 small divided box for salt and pepper

Like most people in the sca my stuff goes to feast in a basket, I can fit in gear for 4 people and it is less than 3 pounds.

-Takeda

[solveig]

Noble Cousins!

Greetings from Solveig! The Japanese would generaly either be using ceramic bowls or lacquerwear bowls. Please do not use beverage bowls. The Japanese do not appear to have generally taken beverage with their meals until comparatively recently. For example, no beverages are consumed during chaseki meals. The Japanese did have drinking parties which had accompanying snacks. These generally used specialized lacquerwear saucers. Tea drinking in Japan is adapted from medicinal practices. The matcha ceremony uses what were originallly medicinal bowls used in Chinese herbal medicine. How did the Japanese make do without beverages? Well, a lot of the dishes had high water content.

If you reallly really want to drink beverages with your meal, then why not get the most ostentatious Western goblet that you can find and use it with your Japanese feast gear? This would be fairly good approach as you would be using the appropriate exogenous piece of equipment to engage in an exogenous practice.

[Saionji Shonagon]

Because Lady Jehanne, being a woman of modest tastes and means, drinks out of an earthenware beaker which is at least as wabi sabi as anything else I own?

Because the feast one's namban hosts are serving may require something liquid to supplement it?

Japan's atmosphere generally has a higher water content than the one I live in. Having a headache on a Monday after an event means I didn't pound down enough fluids that weekend.

Two sen worth,
Saionji

[Takeda Sanjuichiro]

solveig said:

The Japanese would generaly either be using ceramic bowls or lacquerwear bowls.

Very true, I have found however most inexpensive ceramic bowls are very thick and clunky, thus they are heavy to transport, fairly fragile (and being heavy makes it worse) the selection of said inexpensive products is generally not in the style of the fine ceramics used in period Japanese aristocratic feastware.

Please do not use beverage bowls. The Japanese do not appear to have generally taken beverage with their meals until comparatively recently.

I try to use them sparingly, if I am preparing a Japanese meal it is not a problem, there are plenty of soups and liquids. The kit I mentioned is what my feastgear consists of. Since most western feasts do not include anywhere near enough soup dishes, I get parched so I use a bowl similar to either a small soup bowl (ummm why yes, you are right, my miso does look suprisingly like cola) or a large sake bowl. (Its a stout sake... and why yes, it does look like cola) I know what and therefor how I am eating in those situations is not wholly accurate, but I have to make these exceptions to enjoy a western feast, while I still try to equip myself according to my persona. (like the edition of the knife to the feastgear)

If you really really want to drink beverages with your meal, then why not get the most ostentatious Western goblet that you can find and use it with your Japanese feast gear?

I have not yet found a goblet that works for me... I would perfer one out of glass, something along the lines of the one Oda Nobunaga shares with Tokugawa Ieyasu in the camp scene in Kagemusha.

-Takeda

[Saionji Shonagon]

(ummm why yes, you are right, my miso does look suprisingly like cola)

New!Diet Tofu Float Coke. ;D

It can't be any worse than that vile black cherry vanilla one they just put out.

S.

[solveig]

Noble Cousins!

Greetings from Solveig! Well, since I grew up in a desert, I can well understand the desire to quaff fluids. I will also say that the hot season in Japan can be quite a bit more unpleasant than Summer in the desert. Regardless, you are quite right that you need to take in fluids. You should not, incidentally, be drinking cola in such weather as it is a duretic and actually works against keeping you hydrated. There are a number of fine Summer japanese drinks which you might take up quafing. These include the ever popular mugicha and a number of drinks produced using fruit juice.

Incidentally, some formal meals do include small individual sake saucers. However, a lot of sake parties involve drinking from a common sake saucer. You can read about this in the Confessions of Lady Nijo. I do not recally any no evidence for something resembling a true beverage.

[Noriko]

Thank you everyone for your input. I'll keep my eye out for some fake laquerware and/or some more bowls.
I kind of like the ceramic bowls and the events I tend to frequent don't require a lot of supplies, and I since have to pack only for myself, it's usually just bowl, chopsticks and cup, so weight is not an issue.
And even though it's not period practice, I can fit quite a few things into my bowl- I'm a vegetarian so there usually isn't much at feasts that I want/can eat anyway (:

But again, thank you all for your advice.

[Saionji Shonagon]

Thank you everyone for your input. I'll keep my eye out for some fake laquerware and/or some more bowls.

We have Ichiban Can, which is sort of a Japanese 5 & 10 (does anybody remember 5 &10's or am I incredibly ancient?) up the road in El Cerrito. I got a few plastic "lacquer" soup bowls and a bamboo tea caddy quite inexpensively.

www.buy4asianlife.com/
also has some inexpensive plastic "lacquerware" and so forth.

S.

[Ishikawa Yoshimasa]

yes we are getting ancient... we remember $.05 & $.10... they have been replaced by $1 stores... do not encourage them, or they will likely be replaced by $5 and $10 stores<G>

[solveig]

Noble Cousin!

Greetings from Solveig!

iwakawa said:

yes we are getting ancient... we remember $.05 & $.10... they have been replaced by $1 stores... do not encourage them, or they will likely be replaced by $5 and $10 stores<G>

Being somewhat of an antique myself, I recall my mother calling them "dime stores". They were also larger than and rather rather upscale from today's dollar stores. Some of the more folksy of the stablishments called themselves ?? Five & Dime.

Your Humble Servant
Solveig Throndardottir
Amateur Scholar