Westerners first in Japan?

[sebastian]

Just a preface, this is an SCA-ish question. I'm switching personas from my original (late period German) to Japanese, due to my extreme interest in it. However to keep things simpler, I was curious when westerners first started "arriving" in Japan.

Also if anyone has any comprehensive sites about the different periods in Japanese history (I.e. Edo, Meiji) Would be much appreciated Thanks in advance!

Ps. I know it's a really broad question, but I wasn't sure how to narrow it down yet

[Saionji Shonagon]

Timelines:
Click on each era for a summary.
www.mnsu.edu/emuseum/prehistory/japan/japanese_history.html

For SCA purposes, you'll want to look at the periods preceding Edo (1603-1867).

A Chinese junk carrying several Portuguese landed in Japan in 1542 at Tanegashima. Portuguese merchant and missionary expeditions showed up not long after.

[sebastian]

Thanks!

And on the kind of same subject, what's the cut off in time periods for the SCA now? Have been out of things for some years now.

[AJBryant]

The cutoff is 1600, where it has *always* been.

[solveig]

Noble Cousins!

Greetings from Solveig!

Jan 26, 2009 8:37:27 GMT -5 AJBryant said:

The cutoff is 1600, where it has *always* been.

A friend of mine who has been around since ca AS III claims that it is 1650. However, Corpora has specified 1600 for decades.

As for earliest arrival of Europeans, that is unknowable.

[glenn]

1650 is the cutoff date for *documentation* on the assumption that there might be some time lag before some things got written down. Many of us suspect the real reason is that Sir Edwin Berserk wanted to wear a great kilt (belted plaid). FWIW I've been involved since A.S. II; when I was 11 our mother deposited my brother and I on the Lawn at the Claremont Hotel to watch the nice men hit each other with sticks while she went in to visit a friend attending BayCon. Anyway, the strictest limits I've ever read are "focused on Europe in the period between 600 and 1600 AD." For the most part, the "Europe" and "600 AD" part have been ignored since the beginning. I knew a fellow who portrayed mid-period Egyptian and fought in a loincloth decades before Tuchucks came along. I remember when Japanese alter egos were very popular among West Kingdom Norse in the first decade of the SCA.

- Halfdan Ragnarsson, Sailor

[solveig]

The most restrictive "official" description that I have encountered is 1600-1500 Western Europe. The most restrictive "personal" description that I have encountered is a 50 year period in Lotharingia. There are quite a few people who pine for restricting things to England and France during the High Middle Ages.

The reasons that I have heard for extending the time period to 1600 have to do with popularity of the Elizabethan period with a special emphasis on theatre and clothing. People who favor extension to 1650 tend to do so in order to include dances recorded by Caroso and Negri. The extension to 1650 also brings in rapier combat.

The 1600 v. 1650 controversy is ancient. Baron El of the Two Knives who attended the first East Kingdom event in AS III was an adamant supporter of a 1650 cutoff instead of a 1600 cutoff. An interesting feature of a 1650 cutoff is that Harvard becomes a "medieval" college.

600 or or earlier is demanded by those who wish to be Arthurian.

Jan 17, 2017 19:51:07 GMT -5 glenn said:

I knew a fellow who portrayed mid-period Egyptian and fought in a loincloth decades before Tuchucks came along.

Impossible as Cooper's Lake was originally a Tu Chux site and was first used for Pennsic in 2017. To the best of my knowledge, both the Tu Chux and Markland actually predate the Society. However, they both remained much smaller organizations.

I remember when Japanese alter egos were very popular among West Kingdom Norse in the first decade of the SCA.

As I recall, the History of the West Kingdom records the presence of someone recreating Japan at the first East Kingdom event ca. AS III.

As for Westerners in Japan. There were lots of documented Westerners in Japan during the sixteenth century. However, Westerners could have been in Japan much earlier. For example, they imported someone from India to "open the eye" of the great Buddha statue at Tōdaiji ca 728. So, all you need to do is get someone from the Roman Empire to India. It is not difficult to get someone from France to the Roman Empire as Sardinia was part of the Roman empire during the eighth century.