What is an acceptable substitute for urushi/cashew

[rknack]

After a bit more research, I have decided instead of a tatami kabuto (more appropriate for a tatami gusoku) for my first helmet project, I am going to make a jingasa out of buffalo rawhide (like many originals were).

What I am wondering is, what is an acceptable, readily available substitute for the urushi lacquer that was used on original Japanese pieces? Cashew lacquer seems to be scarce. Fred Lohman carries it, but won't sell it to anyone outside of Oregon because it has the same toxins as urushi, just somewhat less concentrated. Namikawa in Japan is out of cashew, too. So, what can I use that would be durable and good-looking, that I can layer on fairly heavy (as I believe the originals were) without cracking or chipping?

[Saionji Shonagon]

I used a high gloss paint by Valspar on a carpentry project that looks a lot like lacquer. You could also use a combination of paint for color and high gloss polyurethane over that.

[solveig]

Noble Cousin!

Greetings from Solveig! Real urushi is applied in multiple thin layers.

[rknack]

Mar 7, 2011 18:45:25 GMT -5 solveig said:

Noble Cousin!

Greetings from Solveig! Real urushi is applied in multiple thin layers.

What I meant was, it could be "built up" thick - with those multiple layers. Like the armors I've seen that use plates that go across the torso, but were built up in places with lacquer to resemble individual scales.

Anyway, it turns out that Japan passed new shipping regs last year that make it illegal to ship cashew lacquer by sea or air. Ridiculous, and unfortunate. So now I'm not sure what can be used as a substitute.

[Please Delete]

Check SE Asian "Lac" and similar sources. SE Asia uses a different type of lacquer that doesn't appear to be as toxic. I know that I've picked up bottles of "lacquer" here and used them without any problem. I recommend just a coat of paint on underneath, though the lacquer did like to "eat" the paint--which was good because then the two became comingled.

I'm not sure if this would or wouldn't work for Japanese armor. I suspect it would, but I just haven't had the time to test.

-Ii

[Deleted]

Mar 7, 2011 21:46:02 GMT -5 Please Delete said:

Check SE Asian "Lac" and similar sources.

Most "Lac" is made from a resin that is excreted by bugs, like Shellac. (Yes, shellac is made from bug goop, even the stuff the use to coat candy.) Wikipedia says lacquer was originally lac-based, though I think it might have just been the nanbanjin misunderstanding things again.

SE Asia uses a different type of lacquer that doesn't appear to be as toxic. I know that I've picked up bottles of "lacquer" here and used them without any problem. I recommend just a coat of paint on underneath, though the lacquer did like to "eat" the paint--which was good because then the two became comingled.

I don't know about the stuff you're buying, but Western modern "lacquer" often uses solvents like xylene or toluene, which will eat just about anything, including brain cells.

Shellac might be an acceptable substitute for urushi. I haven't tried. Using shellac gives you a good excuse to have bottles of pure grain alcohol around the house, while we're discussing things that eat brain cells.

[Please Delete]

Good point. It is still stuff that will likely eat brain cells, but I don't think it has the same "poison ivy" effect.

-Ii

[arashi]

I've been contemplating doing a very similar project. I was probably just going to use a combination of paint and polyurethane instead of actual lacquer myself.

I've not been impressed with the durability of any of the straw jingasa I've been able to find, and was thinking about making my own so I might be able to wear it more than once or twice before it falls apart.

[rknack]

Mar 8, 2011 16:56:15 GMT -5 arashi said:

I've been contemplating doing a very similar project. I was probably just going to use a combination of paint and polyurethane instead of actual lacquer myself.

I've not been impressed with the durability of any of the straw jingasa I've been able to find, and was thinking about making my own so I might be able to wear it more than once or twice before it falls apart.

Try rawhide. That's what I'm going to use. Do a web-search for "buffalo rawhide", and when you buy it, ask the seller to get it fairly thick. Some of the originals issued to ashigaru were made from lacquered buffalo rawhide, rather than iron. After all, some Native American tribes on the plains made shields out of rawhide that could turn arrows or even round-balls from muskets.

[arashi]

Tandy Leather has a store location 15 minutes from me, was going to check out their prices on leather and rawhide. Some of the other materials I had been contemplating were aluminum or plastic sheet which I could cut down and shape. I personally like the Ichimonji gasa style rather than the Bajo gasa, so the shape would be pretty easy to get out of any flat material.

Something along the lines of www.artsofthesamurai.com/jingasa/html/16%20brown.htmlwould be simple enough to make out of leather (possibly rawhide, but I've not worked with rawhide, so I dont know how difficult it would be to shape it)...just cut out a circle, wet it, set it on top of a ball of some sort until you get the right depth...then harden/color/lacquer etc.

[rknack]

Or, make a circle, larger than the finished diameter of the jingasa, cut a wedge out of it, fold it into a cone-shape, overlap the edges, and stitch. That's more-or-less what I am going to do. I want to make a pattern out of poster-board first, to make sure I have everything right before I go cutting the rawhide.

[rknack]

Got my rawhide in the mail yesterday. It's pretty heavy-duty stuff, about 1/16"- 3/32" thick. Should make a good, durable, yet light-weight jingasa.

Now I need to find out how a jingasa's padding and straps are attatched...

[Saionji Shonagon]

Not a jingasa, but it shows how I set up one of my hats.

You might also search on the word "atamadai."

www.flickr.com/photos/70104978@N00/sets/72157603181938617/

[Deleted]

Here is another lacquer alternative I found yesterday, "Black Shellac" www.shellac.net/Shellac_ordering_list.html#660. From the page:

• On Light toned woods, the First coat yields a rich medium Cordovan (Bluish-Red) Mahogany.
• A second Coat is Deeper & Dark Cordovan toned Black.
• The third coat yields the BLACK with a shadowed hint of a DEEP Blackish-Purple tone.

No experience with this product or vendor, but my experience with shellac has been positive. It applies easily, is mostly non-toxic, and can be food-safe. It creates a waterproof, glossy finish without much fuss, and dries quickly.

[yamashita]

HERE YA GO!


www.hyper-cafe.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=12