|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on Jun 27, 2014 0:55:48 GMT -5
I recently picked up a second hand copy of Reconstructing History's Heian Japanese Lady's Informal Robes and am looking to create my first set of period "event ready" Heian garmets. Since I started the SCA, I have been eyeing the following semi-formal outfit as a place to start: However, after an afternoon of reading the instructions and Googling, I've come to understand that the material and layering of colors is very important when considering Heian garments. From what I understand, some colors are restricted based on rank or imperial favor. How do other Japanese personae handle this particular translation from Japanese culture to SCA? Do you pay attention to this detail? Seeing as I am not a peer in the SCA nor do I have a relationship with any of the Kings/Queens in my area, does this mean that certain colors (purples, reds and blues) are off limits if I want to portray my standing correctly? Also, I read that black fabric was never used and that the only place that shows black fabric is from the Costume museum. Can anyone confirm this? Ultimately, I'm looking to make an unlined version of either 青紅葉 / AO MOMIJI Green Maples (Version 1) or and unlined 薄 SUSUKI Pampas Grass (Version 1) from Immortal Geisha's Kasane no Irome page. I'm hoping to purchase fabric in the coming weeks but I'll leave you with one last question: I'm wondering if all Uchigi layers should made of silk or if some layers were linen/hemp material.
|
|
Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
|
Post by Saionji Shonagon on Jun 27, 2014 1:55:11 GMT -5
However, after an afternoon of reading the instructions and Googling, I've come to understand that the material and layering of colors is very important when considering Heian garments. From what I understand, some colors are restricted based on rank or imperial favor. How do other Japanese personae handle this particular translation from Japanese culture to SCA? Do you pay attention to this detail? I do. YOUR choice is YOUR choice. I can't make it for you. BTW, that uwagi is indigo, not black, if you read the "Explanation" at the original Costume Museum Page: " This photograph shows "hitoe-kasane" of summer. The material is raw silk. The pattern "fusen-aya" could be used, but the composite figure is wearing "hitoe" with the pattern of "saiwai-bishi mon" which is indigo blue in color. The undergarment is called "kakitsubata-gasane (iris suit)" which is yellowish green in color. The figure is also wearing "kosode (=undergarment, literally short sleeve)" and red "naga-bakama." Silk, definitely! Try to get your hands on a copy of Liza Dalby's "Kimono: Fashioning Culture" and read her chapter on Heian colors. It'll really help you wrap your head around color sensibilities for the period.
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on Jun 27, 2014 9:37:01 GMT -5
I do. YOUR choice is YOUR choice. I can't make it for you. BTW, that uwagi is indigo, not black, if you read the "Explanation" at the original Costume Museum Page: " This photograph shows "hitoe-kasane" of summer. The material is raw silk. The "Explanation" button wasn't working when I was doing my research but seems to be working now! For my edification, how do you adhere to the color layering rules? Do you substitute or leave out colors that would otherwise be restricted to you? I ask because it seems many of the layered examples have some sort of red in them and from what I understand, red is a color given to court ladies that the empress favored. Is it the outer layer that is most important? Also, is the outer most garment always called an Uwagi regardless of season/number of layers? The pattern "fusen-aya" could be used, but the composite figure is wearing "hitoe" with the pattern of "saiwai-bishi mon" which is indigo blue in color. The undergarment is called "kakitsubata-gasane (iris suit)" which is yellowish green in color. The figure is also wearing "kosode (=undergarment, literally short sleeve)" and red "naga-bakama." I have a white kosode already to go but need to work on my red naga-bakama. That said, I may end up making a shorter version so as not to be worried about dragging fabric around at events. Silk, definitely! Try to get your hands on a copy of Liza Dalby's "Kimono: Fashioning Culture" and read her chapter on Heian colors. It'll really help you wrap your head around color sensibilities for the period. Is this the right Dalby book?? There seems to be two different covers. Got the ISBN perchance? Also, any silk shops you recommend (either Bay Area or online?) Thank you for all the great feedback!
|
|
Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
|
Post by Saionji Shonagon on Jun 27, 2014 11:57:16 GMT -5
BTW, meant to say that there's nothing wrong with building a Heian outfit in stages. I did one over the course of several years. This is the one you want: books.google.com/books/about/Kimono.html?id=PIacVyeWtMcCNagabakama can be tied up under the knee. That's what THEY did. From the skin out: kosode/nagabakama > hitoe > uchigi (middle layers from one to five) > uwagi (figured silk with some sort of pattern). If you are going for full formal, then you add the karaginu (short jacket of figured, patterned silk) and the mo (train). The forbidden colors are specifically kurenai (red)and murasaki (purple), having to do with the cost of the dye. BTW, I'm probably the only person in the kingdom who would even know if you decided to use forbidden colors. Undyed silks can be acquired from Dharma Trading. Thai Silks in Los Altos is a possibility: I've gotten things from there.
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on Jun 29, 2014 17:07:01 GMT -5
BTW, meant to say that there's nothing wrong with building a Heian outfit in stages. I did one over the course of several years. This is the one you want: books.google.com/books/about/Kimono.html?id=PIacVyeWtMcC Nagabakama can be tied up under the knee. That's what THEY did. From the skin out: kosode/nagabakama > hitoe > uchigi (middle layers from one to five) > uwagi (figured silk with some sort of pattern). If you are going for full formal, then you add the karaginu (short jacket of figured, patterned silk) and the mo (train). The forbidden colors are specifically kurenai (red)and murasaki (purple), having to do with the cost of the dye. BTW, I'm probably the only person in the kingdom who would even know if you decided to use forbidden colors. Undyed silks can be acquired from Dharma Trading. Thai Silks in Los Altos is a possibility: I've gotten things from there. No doubt I will be building this outfit in stages as silks tend to be on the higher end of my budget and acknowledging my own skill in that I've never sewn with silk before. In fact, I went to Britex Fabrics this weekend and talked with some of the CSR's there. Their eyes went all dollar signs when I showed them the photo and the pattern noting that I was looking to use silk in the construction of my ensemble. Glad I prefaced my questioning with "I'm here to window shop colors and talk materials." Which brings me to my next question, which kind of silk? I had no idea the spectrum of silk out there! Even your suggestion to Dharma Trading has a variety of undyed silks. I assume the period weaves are very different than modern silk construction but I don't know where to begin to research that topic. Perhaps there will be some discussion in Dalby's book? (which, as an aside, a nicely used copy is on its way to my door!) In talking with the CSR's at Britex, they recommended silk organza as a cost effect alternative with a wide color range as compared to their direct imports from Japan or China. From what I understand, the product also has the ability, depending on the weave, to play with transparency/opacity which could come in handy depending on if I line any of the uchigi. The problem I foresee is that none of the organza line has the patterned silk options I've been reading about. Any thoughts, tips or tricks on ways to achieve the right look? I understand that silk screening or painting on a pattern for the uwagi is a possibility, but what about the uchigi layers below? Speaking of layers, are you recommending I make correctly sized Nagabakama and just tie them up as needed for out-of-doors events? I haven't found any patterns that show what the tying mechanism looks like. Was it integrated into the hem or was it a separate rope, string, piece of fabric? Now I must show restraint from purchasing silks and patience for the mailman. I pause to regard Blue skies with gilded edges 'Has Summer arrived?' I spoke to the Southern winds Waiting for the tides answer.
|
|
Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
|
Post by Saionji Shonagon on Jun 29, 2014 21:21:18 GMT -5
Britex will be happy to bankrupt you. Period. I've been living across the bay from the for years and I cannot justify paying their prices. There's a place over on Clement & Second called Fabrix where you can sometimes get very lucky and find silk taffeta for about $10 a yard. It's hit or miss, but well worth a look, especially as taffeta has a nice sheen and stiffness to it. Have you been here yet? wodefordhall.com/CC26doc.htm explains how I did mine. I basically used a lot of habotai and added linings in cotton to add stiffness and body - not accurate, but I couldn't afford the real thing. Another option is to starch the everlivingcrap out of things to give them the necessary body. If you can find a patterned silk jacquard, that would work well for your uwagi. You can also SOMETIMES find one of those silk blend Asian Brocades that has a good repeating pattern that might work. I'm also a big fan of mimicking things with fabric paint. wodefordhall.com/karaginumo.htm wodefordhall.com/fakingit.htmTime and budget being things we have to live with, you may not want to bother trying to find patterned fabrics for your uchigi, particularly as the only bits showing will be the edges peeping out from beneath your uwagi. Nagabakama hems: run a drawstring inside the bottom hem and then pull them up and garter them at the knee. web.archive.org/web/20030212165754im_/http://www.reconstructinghistory.com/japanese/EKCourt/sasinuki3.gif shows how.
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on Jun 30, 2014 23:10:32 GMT -5
Britex will be happy to bankrupt you. Period. I've been living across the bay from the for years and I cannot justify paying their prices. There's a place over on Clement & Second called Fabrix where you can sometimes get very lucky and find silk taffeta for about $10 a yard. It's hit or miss, but well worth a look, especially as taffeta has a nice sheen and stiffness to it. Have you been here yet? wodefordhall.com/CC26doc.htm explains how I did mine. I basically used a lot of habotai and added linings in cotton to add stiffness and body - not accurate, but I couldn't afford the real thing. Another option is to starch the everlivingcrap out of things to give them the necessary body. If you can find a patterned silk jacquard, that would work well for your uwagi. You can also SOMETIMES find one of those silk blend Asian Brocades that has a good repeating pattern that might work. I'm also a big fan of mimicking things with fabric paint. wodefordhall.com/karaginumo.htm wodefordhall.com/fakingit.htmTime and budget being things we have to live with, you may not want to bother trying to find patterned fabrics for your uchigi, particularly as the only bits showing will be the edges peeping out from beneath your uwagi. Nagabakama hems: run a drawstring inside the bottom hem and then pull them up and garter them at the knee. web.archive.org/web/20030212165754im_/http://www.reconstructinghistory.com/japanese/EKCourt/sasinuki3.gif shows how. While doing more research on silks and other fabrics, I had an epiphany: If I'm making a Japanese garment, shouldn't I try to use/find fabric bolts in the 14" - 17" range? In my mind it would be closer to period construction as the panels would be sewn together along selvage edges. So I did some research and found Japan Made. They have some amazing bolts of silk though many of the patterns are more modern. However, I did find this lovely thing that could act as a stunning Mo for more formal attire or could be dyed using www.dharmatrading.com/techniques/silkpaint/dyes-for-silk-painting-also-for-wool-and-nylon.html. Granted, I don't have much experience in dying silk but I thought that might be an interesting way to get a Japanese silk in both a subtle pattern in the colors I'm looking for in my garb. Either way, I thought I'd share my discovery. Has anyone ever purchased anything from Japan Made? Also, I've sent a message back to the owners of Japan Made, Gaku and Tina Imada, to see if they could procure colored bolts of silk that are pre-dyed in the colors I'm looking for and they've already sent back a reply that they are on the job. I'll keep you informed on if it's a cost effective method. Which brings me to my second find of the day and along the same "frugal" thought process. As I am sure you know, silk is EXPENSIVE! So it got me thinking, "Where to Japanese seamstresses/seamsters get discounted silks?" The answer might be Shinei. Has anyone ever purchased silk from this website before? Full disclosure, many of the bolts have minor discoloration or other minor damages but nothing that would chase me away outright. Plus the dying technique mentioned above might actually hide some of the blemishes. It's an exciting prospect as many of the fabrics are white with interesting patterns that could add some great texture to any outfit. Of course you'd want to layer in some solid colors as well, but it looks like they have you covered there too. Thoughts?
|
|
Saionji Shonagon
New Member
One dreamed of becoming somebody. Another remained awake and became. (Found in a fortune cookie.)
Posts: 7,240
|
Post by Saionji Shonagon on Jul 1, 2014 0:03:34 GMT -5
I've never purchased from either of those vendors. I've had some luck with Ichiroya and japan.antiques on eBay in the past.
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on Jul 11, 2014 23:48:26 GMT -5
So I decided to pull the trigger and order a white bolt of silk from Shinei. The process was somewhat odd as their Paypal system is not entirely seamless but not unheard of for overseas purchase. The fabric is being shipped from Osaka and I'll post some photos to give ya'll an idea of what an "excellent" minor defect bolt of fabric means. Looking forward to seeing the quality for sure. Also, I will most likely be experimenting with dying the silk to get the right color(s) for each kinu. I'm in the process of reading Liza Dalby's book as well as Nature's Colors Dyes from Plants by Ida Grae. It was recommended to me by a former SCAdian as an alternative to buying premade dyes. I'm curious, has anyone on the forums come across the text before and have you tried any of the techniques?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2014 7:38:36 GMT -5
Nature's Colors Dyes from Plants by Ida Grae. It was recommended to me by a former SCAdian as an alternative to buying premade dyes. I'm curious, has anyone on the forums come across the text before and have you tried any of the techniques? I asked one of our local SCAdian dyeing enthusiasts (She mostly dyes yarn to support her knitting.) and she responded, "That is one of the books I use." There may be more information later, but if Mistress Irene says it's OK, it's probably OK. She does a lot of dying, and dye-producing plants make up much of her garden.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2014 6:01:27 GMT -5
Mistress Irene wrote:
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on Jul 20, 2014 22:00:41 GMT -5
I just received my first bolt from Shinei and I am extremely happy with the purchase. The silk arrived as advertised and while there is some discoloration around the edges, the overarching quality is great. The total cost, including shipping, was only $61.00. So far I would recommend using them for your discounted silk needs. Next steps include experiments with dying, a kumihimo flat braid for my naga-bakama, and then try my hand at actually sewing up a uchigi. Stay tuned!
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on Apr 19, 2015 2:39:03 GMT -5
I just received my first bolt from Shinei and I am extremely happy with the purchase. The silk arrived as advertised and while there is some discoloration around the edges, the overarching quality is great. The total cost, including shipping, was only $61.00. So far I would recommend using them for your discounted silk needs. Next steps include experiments with dying, a kumihimo flat braid for my naga-bakama, and then try my hand at actually sewing up a uchigi. Stay tuned! The best laid plans... A little update on the items above. The fabric from Shinei is still rather lovely and is 3/4 sewn together. Next steps include finishing the right side and collar. The problem I am ultimately facing is the width of the bolt. I had done measurements of my arm span and a 14" bolt works in theory, but it a bit short when I put my arms down. In my further research and experiments, a 16"-18" wide bolt would have been more appropriate. I have found that those sizes are rare on Shinei. So while the quality is great, the sizing is just too modern for our clothing reconstruction and thus will most likely not be a resource to tap into. All that said, it's been good hand sewing practice for me. Over the past few months (oh my! it's been almost a year since I started this project!) I have purchased 4 different types of silks and dye colors from Dharma Trading Company. I've never dyed anything other than a white cotton tie dye T-shirt, so this process was a bit of a stretch for me. If you'd like the details on the process and some photos, see below.
Junihitoe silk test dye #1. Material(s): Dharma Trading Company (DTC) silks (above) from left to right: silk twill 12mm, silk dupion 19mm, raw silk, and silk habotai 16mm. Material weight: 38 grams dry silk. Color: 16 Maroon fiber reactive dye. Method: Hot bath dye method. ( instructions provided by DTC) Conversions: 12 grams equivalent dye per DTC's instruction. 270 equivalent salt (for max vibrancy). Time: 10 mins simmer + 10 min citric acid simmer + Dharma Professional Textile Detergent Thoughts/Impressions: It's beautiful but unexpected. It looks more purple/fuscia than maroon to me. It's possible I chose the wrong color to achieve 薄 SUSUKI Pampas Grass (Version 2). That said, it's great to get some knowledge on the process of hot bath dyeing. My favorite materials, if I had to choose today, are the silk dupion and the raw silk. More experimentation is required. Perhaps these can be used to create favors or Omamori 御守 . Does anyone know what period cloth Omamori are invented/introduced in/to Japan? As for the kumihimo flat braid, I haven't even started that portion of the project yet. Currently researching places to purchase materials and which flat braid to attempt. I do have a pattern for the naga-bakama so it's just a matter of time and $'s. It even might be fun to dye a pair. A raw silk PR136 : OXBLOOD RED from DTC might do the trick nicely.
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on May 2, 2015 21:23:12 GMT -5
A quick photo update.
Junihitoe silk test dye #2 and #3. Material(s): Dharma Trading Company (DTC) silks (above) from left to right: silk twill 12mm, raw silk, silk dupion 19mm, and silk habotai 16mm. Material weight: ~34-37 grams dry silk. Color: 16 Maroon fiber reactive dye. Method: Hot bath dye method. ( instructions provided by DTC) Conversions: Light tones = 4 grams equivalent dye per DTC's instruction. 270 equivalent salt (for max vibrancy). Medium Tones =8 grams equivalent dye per DTC's instruction. 270 equivalent salt (for max vibrancy). Time: Light tones = 3 mins simmer + 3 min citric acid simmer + Dharma Professional Textile Detergent. Medium Tones = 5 mins simmer + 5 min citric acid simmer + Dharma Professional Textile Detergent. Thoughts/Impressions: Again, the colors do not reflect the intent of producing the Maroons from 薄 SUSUKI Pampas Grass (Version 2) but looking on it does produce colors that could be used in 梅重 UME GASANE Plum Layers or perhaps 紫の薄様 MURASAKI NO USUYOU Thinning Violet. Also, the sheen and light will subtly changes the look of each. My biggest surprise was how the raw silk (picture 2) turned out. The lightest color is almost a pale pink instead of a pale maroon or violet but the threads at the edges are a true violet. Also each type of silk stayed true to itself. Meaning the colors gradient well within each silk type but jump all around the map compared to each other. Dyeing is addictive and it produces beautiful items! Again, I plan on using these silk tests for something other than practice and might experiment with painting my kamon design or even try my hand at embroidery. I still haven't found any information on the origins on Omamori 御守 but I haven't dove in head first really. A special shout out to Saionji-dono for inspiring me to attempt this crazy process. Not quite ready for full scale but I can see it on the horizon! Next up: Junihitoe silk test dyeing both 淡青 Light Blue-Green and 青 Blue-Green!
|
|
|
Post by Kagami Tomoko on May 20, 2015 0:43:41 GMT -5
Another quick photo update. Junihitoe silk test dye #4 and #5. Material(s): Dharma Trading Company (DTC) silks (above) same as before. Material weight: ~34-37 grams dry silk. Color: Kingfisher and Better Blue-Green fiber reactive dye. Method: Hot bath dye method. ( instructions provided by DTC) Conversions: Light tones = 8 grams equivalent dye per DTC's instruction. 270 equivalent salt (for max vibrancy). Dark Tones = 8 grams equivalent dye per DTC's instruction. 270 equivalent salt (for max vibrancy). Time: Light tones = 5 mins simmer + 5 min citric acid simmer + Dharma Professional Textile Detergent. Dark Tones = 10 mins simmer + 10 min citric acid simmer + Dharma Professional Textile Detergent. Thoughts/Impressions: The goal was to recreate both 淡青 Light Blue-Green and 青 Blue-Green. Again, not sure I selected the right colors (too blue?) but the process is fun. The other interesting element is that the colors really change depending on what kind of light. Also, I feel like the raw silk dyes are coming out closer in color but the vibrancy is just not there. Has anyone dealt with raw silk before? Next up: Baby Pink? and perhaps lighter tones of Better Blue-Green? Extra Credit: I recently picked up another new book that I can't read... but absolutely love it regardless! It shows some detail shots for fabric patterns, real life models and drawings of heian clothing and beyond. It truly is a beautiful book. I took a few photos for funsies. Book Cover I really like the pink outfit and am considering this as another garb item. This design is new to me, specifically the train that is integrated with the robes. I'm used to the classic "mo" apron. Super gorgeous. Fans, Hats, and kikutoji oh my! Just a sample of the fabric details.
|
|